Microsoft has a Windows 11 problem. Staying on Windows 10 is a symptom.
obligatory 🐧 that must be in every thread
Many years ago, I attended a Windows XP launch event. The Microsoft presenter had the perfect line to describe how MS views this:
“Why should you upgrade to Windows XP? Because we’re going to stop supporting Windows 98!”This was said completely unironically and with the expectation that people would just do what MS wanted them to do. That attitude hasn’t changed in the years since. Win 10 is going to be left behind. You will either upgrade or be vulnerable. Also, MS doesn’t care about the home users, they care about the businesses and the money to be had. And businesses will upgrade. They will invariably wait to the last minute and then scramble to get it done. But, whether because they actually give a shit about security or they have to comply with security frameworks (SOX, HIPAA, etc.), they will upgrade. Sure, they will insist on GPOs to disable 90% of the Ads and tracking shit, but they will upgrade.
Because we’re going to stop supporting Windows 98!
At least there was a technical reason there, that Microsoft was merging the two separate codebases for consumer Windows and enterprise Windows, and building on the better NT codebase than the 95->98->ME codebase.
And XP was actually way better for the main thing that we were going to be using computers for going forward: networked with the actual internet.
Windows 11? Can’t see any paradigm shift in how the operating system itself is supposed to work, at least not on anything that actually makes a difference in a favorable way.
Ya, in fairness to MS, Windows XP was a good release (post SP1, like most “good” MS releases). But, the fact is that MS is going to push the latest version, regardless of how ready it is for use. MS was hot for folks to switch to Windows ME. And holy fuck was that a terrible OS. MS also did everything short of bribery to get folks to switch to Vista (anyone remember Windows Mojave?). The “upgrade, or else” mantra has always been their way. Not that I blame them too much, it does need to happen. It just sucks when the reason for the new OS is more intrusive ads and user tracking.
Businesses (at least the larger ones) replace their hardware every few years anyway. They don’t care whether their new Optiplexes run Windows 10 or 11 and most hardware bought since 2022 probably has Windows 11 installed already, probably all since 2020 supports it. So there’s hardly a problem here. (Btw I’m taking the management view here, I know that it’s a pain to actually deploy, but that doesn’t matter to management).
Yes your right. Users only care if their software can run. Most could care less what OS is running under the hood.
I mean, they could solve it by not making the mandatory successor an ad-laden, AI-infested, personal data harvesting, privacy-nightmare shit show. That would be a start. And also relax whatever the artificial requirement is that makes a lot of Win10 machines incompatible with 11.
Windows 10 is already an ad-laden, AI-infested, personal data harvesting, privacy-nightmare shit show. The problem with 11 is the ridiculous hardware requirements.
Windows 10 is trash and has always been. Windows 7 was the last good Windows, and I would still use it if it had security updates and DX12 support (I obviously mainly use Linux, but my gaming PC is on Windows, and no, some games I play and software I use 100% do not work on Linux).
Probably is. I use Linux for everything and only use Win10 at work on a VM with enterprise/LTSB version, so I’ve been shielded from most of its enshittification.
Having used both, doesn’t 11 have the same level of ads as 10 did? It seems like it’s really only OneDrive ads if you don’t use it if anything?
Maybe? I just said in another comment that I am pretty much exclusively Linux. I only occasionally use a W10 VM at work, and it’s enterprise/LTSB so I don’t get a lot of that junk.
100 point top thread based on the second and third hand opinions of a Windows non-user really sums up the quality of this discussion lol
You can bypass the requirements since yeah, they were always artificial. I believe Rufus has an option when creating Win11 install USBs to remove the TPM and other requirements.
But then again, it’s nice, because all I need to make sure Microsoft doesn’t secretly update my Win10 machine in the night to Win11 is to turn off the TPM in the BIOS.
But then you won’t receive any updates if you use unsupported hardware to run Win 11
Well, not gonna get updates on 10 either, so is same-same
You can bypass the requirements since yeah, they were always artificial.
I think bypassing these checks would eventually render your PC vulnerable? for example, bitlocker support being void for computers that relies on TPM 2.0
There is no home-user need to run bitlocker. There’s dozens of alternatives, that do not rely on TPM, that are just as effective, and that you really should be using anyways since they aren’t controlled by M$.
I see, thanks
If you need encryption, veracrypt probably still works.
Rufus has that option, I’ve used it myself to update to Win11 because I didn’t have a motherboard with TPM at the time.
Also wanna mention, the reason I updated was mostly because I thought Win10 was kinda ugly and I think Win11 was a huge update in that regard and also because of security reasons, since Win10 won’t receive any more updates in the near future. At the end of the day, I can count on one hand how often I boot Windows in a year (I almost exclusively use Linux), so I don’t really care about all the Win11 bullshit anyway.
Nope, they wont. Micro$oft only cares money rather than basic OS for everyday and professional tasks
They’ve been adding spyware and ads into W10 so it’s not the money. They could easily add all W11 ads/spyware into 10 with an update. Older CPUs have several hardware vulnerabilities unrelated to the TPU required by W11.
IMO, they should add a startup message listing the hardware vulnerabilities of the installed CPU and leave it up to the customer.
Windows 11 has more spyware and its more ens***tificated
Yes but that could be added in a W10 update just like they’ve already done with previous W10 updates.
The author asks many questions, but never the most important one: “Why don’t people like Windows 11?”
Why would he? Anybody intersted already knows, rest doesn’t give a flying duck.
I know it’s not a hardware compatibility problem. People just don’t want ads/tracking/AI bullshit, a removed control panel, settings that are hard to find/hidden, etc.
All intel processor 8th gen+ (and even some 7th gen IIRC) are win11 compatible, motherboard have TPM2 for years, even my intel 6th gen MB have TPM2.0.
Next year the intel 8th gen will have 8 years, people have PC/laptop more recent than that. Problem is that win10 will not get security updates and all.
I’m using MX Linux BTW.
6th gen intel and 1st gen ryzen run perfectly fucking fine still.
My parents are using a 3rd gen i7 and it works fine. My brother has a few computers, one is a 2nd gen intel, but I think he put Linux on that one. My home server was running on my 4th gen i7 until I upgraded it to my second gen Ryzen earlier this year after I upgraded my gaming.
It’s not a hardware compatibility problem for you or people who have reasonably new computers. However, for the last decade or so, computers have kind of stagnated and old computers are still very functional, something I couldn’t have said a decade or two ago.
I’m typing this on a ThinkPad x201 which was released in 2010. TBF, I’ve updated it as much as I can (8GB of RAM and an SSD), it’s running Linux Mint because Windows drags, and even then it’s getting tired.
My Spouse’s laptop is an Acer with a 5th gen i3. A couple years ago, she was complaining it was getting a bit slow, so I threw an SSD in it and now she’s happy with how it runs Windows 10, and I’m sure it would run Windows 11 fine if a TPM2.0 chip wasn’t required.
It’s forced obsolesces for a hardware requirement most home users are never going to use.
I’m currently using a trick on my Windows 11 work machine to get the old UI for file explorer by going through the control panel and going up a directory.
I’ll be so pissed the day they strip it out, because their new design language is ridiculously slow and terrible for the sake of “cleanliness.”
My question is this: Do Microsoft ship crap-infested versions to people who could make their lives uncomfortable, like, say, intelligence agencies, or do those agencies take a crap-infested version and have their IT security strip all the crap out?
Because if I was in charge of an intelligence agency I’d be asking - with dangerous smile - for the crap-free version, turn IT loose on it anyway and then be, shall we say, horribly invasive to Microsoft if there’s anything still left in it.
… and if I wanted Windows, I’d want whatever the end result of that is.
On the other hand, maybe this has already happened and that “horrible invasion” is the cause of all the spyware crap in the consumer release.
Sigh.
Both. The enterprise edition has less crap, but most big companies will use custom images and group policy to decrapify it further. I do the same thing at home since I used to be the guy doing it at work. I don’t get any of the copilot or recall bullshit.
Lots of people moving to Linux over Win11 anyway.
A lot do myself included. But not enough to matter. Most ordinary Windows users don’t even know what Linux is or understand why they should care.
hahahahahah does anyone really think microsoft cares? their money is in business with all the big players already deploying 11 at least in modest amounts.
nothing stopped them when windows7 was still functional and they were pushing the tpm requirement, i dont see a difference here.
Guys, is it the beginning downfall of Windows after October 24, 2025? 🤔
Lol no.
I wish.
There might be a small uptick of new Linux installs, but MS will just power on and the vast majority of Windows users will remain in that abusive relationship. :sigh:
Yeah. People just don’t make the effort to “learn a new OS”.
They get crazy if the icons are in some other place than they are used to on Windows.
Let’s see the facts here ppl.
It has more to do with corporations than individuals. Microsoft doesn’t pay the bills from great grandma Ethel’s Windows license, they have a corporate revenue stream they need to keep locked in.
Yes the real money is in corporations, of course. And large companies won’t change anytime soon.
But let’s face it, as i was refering on a individual level, is any of your non tech savy family and friends install an other OS other over Windows?
I find that rather hard to believe.
People are creatures of habit.
Are you going to pay for retraining 30,000 employees?
Or to make all your software work on Linux?
Autocad?
No, not me.
I didn’t even mentioned Linux, did I? Can be MacOS or FreeBSD.
I guess you assumed I did since its the default answer to suggest Linux as Windows is a shitshow. However, I realize that ordinary people won’t change a thing. They will just use the OS that came installed with the computer. That’s (windows) 99 % of all computers sold.
And yes, I do use Linux but I’m tech savy and a realist about the Windows situation.
Realistically, there are probably half of office workstations, maybe more, where the business users who use them can do everything they need through a browser.
In that sense most stuff already works on Linux, including basic productivity software, email and calendaring, real time communications through Slack or Teams or whatever.
More specialized jobs might need more specialized software, but for many workers they don’t need that.
