I thought the conservative stance was that there’s no systemic racism. Your co-workers actually think all racism is solved, in the US of all places?? Sheesh
Dawg, I think you may be overestimating many conservatives. Most of them don’t draw a line between personal racism and systemic racism, and many of them think racism was “solved” when Obama was elected president.
They think that “racism” is when you’re openly lynching brown people in the town square. Or marching in klan robes. Or Nazi saluting a Nazi flag. Because they aren’t doing that, it means they’re not racist. They’re not smart enough to understand anything more subtle or indirect like generational poverty caused by a series of intentional hamstringings from enslavement to redlining and the like.
I thought the conservative stance was that there’s no systemic racism.
I mean, there’s no limit to how stupid people can be. But I think a lot of conservatives like to say that the racism of the past doesn’t matter anymore. That a family that was enslaved 160 years ago (just beyond living memory now, but potentially someone’s great-great-grandparent), and then subject to Jim Crow and other cruelties through… generously the 1960s but realistically the 1980s, that family has no long lasting effects.
But really it’s important to remember that conservatives just say things. They don’t care about facts or truth. They care about power, and their emotions. So even if you proved that racism was systemic and had measurable effects (eg: The Color of Law), it won’t matter. They don’t care about facts. They care about feelings.
This is funny because many conservatives say things like “facts don’t care about your feelings”, but it’s well known that conservatives project more than movie theaters.
Unfortunately, I had a middle aged white dude make that argument to me while I was a bartender. This was a little before the pandemic, in one of the least diverse states in the U.S. (population is ~90% white people). He said that in his entire life, he had never witnessed or experienced anyone be racist to anyone else, ever, and the only reason why people think it’s an issue is because the news is overly sensational and tries to divide us. I tried to tell him his experiences are not universal and cannot be taken as representative of the experiences of a person of color, but he was not having it. Since I was about half his age at the time, he said I didn’t have enough life experience to know that. This is despite the fact that I have several friends with first hand experience with racism in the same state he lived. They’ve been called slurs, followed around in stores, harassed by police and school administrations in public school, been told to go back to their own country (even though this is their own country, and the person telling them this is not indigenous), and numerous other examples.
It was a frustrating conversation that didn’t go anywhere. It’s especially disheartening that he at least recognized that the news tries to divide us, but then started repeating Fox News taking points when I tried sharing some of the things my friends have been through.
I remember once on a forum a big cis het guy was saying that he’s never seen cat calling on the street. Never him, and never at any of his friends. Someone pointed out that since he’s a big dude, he’s probably not going to be catcalled, and other shitty dudes are likely not going to bother people near him because of patriarchy.
To everyone’s surprise, he came back and was like “ok that makes sense. And I asked my women friends and they told me a lot of stories”
Glad to hear he actually checked with the women in his life for their perspective. I’m sure the guy in my example did not have any friends who were POC. If he did, he never bothered to ask them about their experiences with racism and they never felt comfortable enough with him to tell him about their experiences. Based on his age, in the era he grew up, the state was over 95% white people, and that was likely more concentrated to urban areas. If I had to place a bet, I would say the area he grew up in was rural or suburban. It was just wild to me that he never considered that things could be different for other people living in a different area.
If I’m remembering correctly, this was during the time that NFL athletes were kneeling for the national anthem and conservatives were losing their minds over it. He was watching a game playing on the TV, watched them kneel instead of stand, and commented that BLM is a stupid, pointless movement. The conversation ensued from there.
One of the privileges if being a white guy is that other white guys wont even try hiding their racism from you if all you do is keep your mouth shut. Then you can let them run it all out before letting it slip that you aren’t one of their friends.
Yeah, it’s a real privilege to be subjected to a bigoted rant while waiting for an elevator because they assume you’ll be on their side in the coming race war.
nOonE sAyS ThAt
Racists and most of the Bible Belt says that.
Let me introduce you to the majority of my conservative coworkers.
I thought the conservative stance was that there’s no systemic racism. Your co-workers actually think all racism is solved, in the US of all places?? Sheesh
Dawg, I think you may be overestimating many conservatives. Most of them don’t draw a line between personal racism and systemic racism, and many of them think racism was “solved” when Obama was elected president.
They think that “racism” is when you’re openly lynching brown people in the town square. Or marching in klan robes. Or Nazi saluting a Nazi flag. Because they aren’t doing that, it means they’re not racist. They’re not smart enough to understand anything more subtle or indirect like generational poverty caused by a series of intentional hamstringings from enslavement to redlining and the like.
So much so that I have one white coworker who openly uses the n-word because it’s “not racist anymore”.
What the actual fuck‽
We’ve had a few words over the years. He doesn’t use slurs within earshot of me anymore, but I can’t lie and say it’s the easiest to work with him.
I mean, there’s no limit to how stupid people can be. But I think a lot of conservatives like to say that the racism of the past doesn’t matter anymore. That a family that was enslaved 160 years ago (just beyond living memory now, but potentially someone’s great-great-grandparent), and then subject to Jim Crow and other cruelties through… generously the 1960s but realistically the 1980s, that family has no long lasting effects.
But really it’s important to remember that conservatives just say things. They don’t care about facts or truth. They care about power, and their emotions. So even if you proved that racism was systemic and had measurable effects (eg: The Color of Law), it won’t matter. They don’t care about facts. They care about feelings.
This is funny because many conservatives say things like “facts don’t care about your feelings”, but it’s well known that conservatives project more than movie theaters.
Jinkies!
…a lot of people say that.
lucky you for not being surrounded by fucking idiots, i guess tho?
A lot of *racists" say that. Or at least racist apologists.
Racist apologists are also racists.
bingo.
Unfortunately, I had a middle aged white dude make that argument to me while I was a bartender. This was a little before the pandemic, in one of the least diverse states in the U.S. (population is ~90% white people). He said that in his entire life, he had never witnessed or experienced anyone be racist to anyone else, ever, and the only reason why people think it’s an issue is because the news is overly sensational and tries to divide us. I tried to tell him his experiences are not universal and cannot be taken as representative of the experiences of a person of color, but he was not having it. Since I was about half his age at the time, he said I didn’t have enough life experience to know that. This is despite the fact that I have several friends with first hand experience with racism in the same state he lived. They’ve been called slurs, followed around in stores, harassed by police and school administrations in public school, been told to go back to their own country (even though this is their own country, and the person telling them this is not indigenous), and numerous other examples.
It was a frustrating conversation that didn’t go anywhere. It’s especially disheartening that he at least recognized that the news tries to divide us, but then started repeating Fox News taking points when I tried sharing some of the things my friends have been through.
I remember once on a forum a big cis het guy was saying that he’s never seen cat calling on the street. Never him, and never at any of his friends. Someone pointed out that since he’s a big dude, he’s probably not going to be catcalled, and other shitty dudes are likely not going to bother people near him because of patriarchy.
To everyone’s surprise, he came back and was like “ok that makes sense. And I asked my women friends and they told me a lot of stories”
Rare to see someone change their mind like that.
Glad to hear he actually checked with the women in his life for their perspective. I’m sure the guy in my example did not have any friends who were POC. If he did, he never bothered to ask them about their experiences with racism and they never felt comfortable enough with him to tell him about their experiences. Based on his age, in the era he grew up, the state was over 95% white people, and that was likely more concentrated to urban areas. If I had to place a bet, I would say the area he grew up in was rural or suburban. It was just wild to me that he never considered that things could be different for other people living in a different area.
If I’m remembering correctly, this was during the time that NFL athletes were kneeling for the national anthem and conservatives were losing their minds over it. He was watching a game playing on the TV, watched them kneel instead of stand, and commented that BLM is a stupid, pointless movement. The conversation ensued from there.
Good on him for actually listening and checking with people who would know more
America without the racism would be like ice cream with no vanilla flavoring. Not even the racists would be trying to tell you its not there.
Nah they think it’s in the past and black people are holding themselves back at this point.
Seriously.
One of the privileges if being a white guy is that other white guys wont even try hiding their racism from you if all you do is keep your mouth shut. Then you can let them run it all out before letting it slip that you aren’t one of their friends.
Yeah, it’s a real privilege to be subjected to a bigoted rant while waiting for an elevator because they assume you’ll be on their side in the coming race war.