I tried Bluesky before I found Lemmy. I really wanted to like it but after a few months I decided it wasn’t for me. It’s got a chicken-or-egg problem and you need to bring your own fanbase if want to have any interaction.
I never liked Twitter and don’t feel it’s a particularly good model for actual socializing. I think it was created back when people were still hacking together ideas, it sort of worked, and it hasn’t changed much since.
It’s great for disseminating stuff, terrible at creating space for discussion.
The founders seem like a bunch of young ultra-capitalists who sensed an opening in the market and are just shooting their shot. The app reflects this in subtle ways.
Yeah I just can’t really get into any of the twitter like platforms.
Xitter is loosing users too. So where are people going? Threads?
Or is the format becoming less relevant?
»TikTok« aka vertical short video. Even Loops is growing! - But yes, also Threads, Reddit etc.
I gave Bluesky a shot and didn’t really like it. This might have to do with how I never liked Twitter before or after the rebranding.
I do think the branding is way better than mastodon though.
I still love Bluesky. Mastodon has never even got off the ground and X is the biggest shit hole on the planet. Where else am I gonna go? There is no alternative.
wafrn, can do both bs & fv
Here’s the thing.
looks around
Hmmmm, yeah. That’s what I thought. Everyone here is the wrong audience to really comment on this.
The reason peoples opinion here doesn’t matter much is because like it or not, Lemmy is a hive mindset.
Don’t like linux? Booooooo
Don’t care about open source? Boooooo
Don’t engage in antisocial behavior? Boooooo
And thats the audience here. It’s impossible for you to comment on the mental state of the general broad population when this site seemingly collects an audience that goes out of their way to stay away from the broad general population. How could you possibly relate to someone like my brother in law, who uses Windows 11, without issue? I asked him how he can stsnd all the AI, and the spying. I was expecting an actual answer, and maybe some insight as to how to not make Windows 11 the dumpster fire that it is. Instead, he defends Windows 11 with blind faith ignorance. Insisting that there is no spying in Windows 11, and the AI is actually a good thing.
And I watched as an entire room nodded along in understanding. All agreeing with these points. I realized in that moment that there is zero conversation to be had with these people. I know for fact that Windows 11 spies on you. I know for fact that there is AI in Windows 11. It’s easy to see that if left at its current rate, that AI and data centers that support AI will inevitably lead to mass water shortages.
And I’m confident that these words would land harder here on Lemmy, where I think 99% of you understand the gravity and real nature of what I’m saying.
The problem is, 99% of Lemmy’s typical userbase accounts for 0.01% of the general population. This website is a bubble. Which is a shame, because I fully believe the model for Lemmys infrastructure is the cure for the problems that the general population complain about.
But it’ll never be tested at scale. Most people do not give a fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck about privacy, or open source, or decentralization. Facebook knows my phone number, and has photos of me. Against my consent. And my mom who’s in her 80s, who uses facebook to keep in touch with her sewing community, sees nothing wrong here.
Thats why the people here, who only support mastodon, will never understand why that stratagy won’t work for the masses. And honestly, even if it did, then it wouldn’t work for you.
Because twitter has something like 375 million users. When taylor swift wants to promote something, she does it on twitter. Because it’s where the people are. It’s also a right wing agenda platform, owned by a literal seig hailing nazi, but yet its still the default service regardless if you’re left or right. It’s just where the people are.
Here is what you have done. You saw an ocean. You took note of all the problems fish have in the ocean. You then designed a new concept where fish can swim in a tiny little manufactured pond. But if it gets too small, it can be scaled bigger. You removed the threats of being eaten. You’ve removed the fishing boats. You managed the algae. You planted seaweed so they have food. You installed everything a fish needs to have a happier healthier life from your perspective.
Except there’s no water in this pond. The fediverse concentrates so hard on the advanced features that would make for a great experience…and then forgets the basics that are needed to support life here. Social media only survives when it has an audience, just as fish only survive when they have water.
All the advanced stuff that goes unused in the fediverse means nothing without an audience. Basically if bluesky dies, the users go back to twitter.
You complain that mastodon is better. But bluesky only got popular because the general population didn’t want twitter with nazis. They wanted old twitter. Bluesky is old twitter without the nazis. Thats all they wanted. But it’s only got a tiny fraction of the audience twitter has. So again, taylor swift says her things on twitter. Not bluesky. Not enough people on bluesky to be considered the default. Just like the fediverse can’t keep fish surviving without water, the same is true on bluesky.
The order it goes is that celebrities need to say things to hold an audience. Before the internet, that platform was tv/radio. There were also a lot less celebrities. Because tv/radio just didn’t have a need to create more celebrities. But now, a celebrity can either get their message across to 375 million, or 14 million.
Celebrities go where there is an infrastructure that can handle their fame, and the audience goes where the celebrities go. Below that are us. We’re not the 14 million. Lemmy has 60k and shrinking. But for us the order goes “infrastructure THEN audience”. Which is never going to pull in a huge audience. It can support a large audience. Argueably better. But it’ll never be tested.
Honestly I personally, selfishly, hope Lemmy never gets anywhere near Facebook or Twitter huge.
Most people are fucking boring idiot assholes, full of actually boring and stupid ideas and opinions they only think are clever or notable because them and their social circle are broadly ignorant and hypnotized by marketing.
I prefer a smaller community where people at least tend toward not being idiots, and not being boring.
I don’t want to hear from a celebrity, as their celebrity self.
I don’t want advertising to be viable.
You are right; most people do not care about things that they should, if they actually believed half the things they say they do. Most people are enormously massive hypocrites about most things, whether theyre aware of that or not.
I am under no illusion that people, broadly, when freely handed the solution to a large chunk of their problems, will use it, if it means they suffer any kind of inconvenience whatsoever.
I am under no illusion that most people want what they claim they want; they just want to be popular, or be where the most other people are.
If Bluesky dies and the users go back to Twitter, they never believed in anything more than ‘I want to be part of the herd.’
What you identify as a lack of water, I see as a functioning primary filtration system that prevents microplastic infected water from coming in to the system.
Keep Lemmy Weird.
I also find it odd that you would likely describe all that as anti-social.
… having preferences for the kind of people you enjoy socializing with… is not anti social. You seem to be functionally saying that not starting a massive marketing drive, that in itself is anti social.
This to me is either completely insane, or you don’t understand what ‘anti-social’ means.
The corporate paradigm for social media… that is anti-social. ‘Demonstrates a chronic pattern of disregarding the rights and well-bring of others.’ They literally act as fine-tuned personalized, digital drugs to manipulate your thoughts and emotions, by exploiting your weaknesses.
If Bluesky dies and the users go back to Twitter, they never believed in anything more than ‘I want to be part of the herd.’
- If ATproto (I migrated to Blacksky last year when Bsky made an unpopular ToS change) dies, I also have a Mastodon account I’ve been active on lately although my Mastodon account predates my ATproto account by a couple years, that I’ll happily move to full time, I killed my Twitter months ago because I wasn’t even active on there anymore anyways plus the baggage associated with that platform now, and I don’t plan on setting another one back up.
You make some good points, but you’re making the same mistake you’re accusing your audience of making: you don’t understand why people are on the platform they are on.
I can’t speak for everyone, so I’ll just speak for myself: I’m not on Lemmy and Mastodon because I want them to become the next Facebook–even if it were some kind of libre utopia free of commercial interests.
I’m here because these weirdos are my weirdos and they like the same weird things I like. It’s a small enough sandbox that I can still recognize people here and there. These people have similar interests to me, and they post long, insightful rants about stuff that my family and other friends would not care about. The network effect is working in my favor.
The fediverse community feels more like home to me than the big social platforms. This feels more like it’s my community. If Lemmy gets as big as Reddit, I’ll probably go somewhere else.
I don’t use Linux because I want it to dominate the world. I don’t care if others use Linux or not. I use Linux because my computer finally feels like it’s mine again. I do what I want with it and I don’t have to worry about AI running or spying happening on it without my knowledge. As a bonus, it runs smoother.
The tradeoff is there are a few rough edges, and I have to learn some new things. But I enjoy learning. Lots of people don’t enjoy having to learn new things to just veg out with IG or YouTube. I get that. So, then don’t. Veg out with Windows, if that’s your thing. We can all do our own thing at the same time.
Choice is a good thing. Small communites are good. Decentralized is good because then big bullies can’t come in and take your community away. Small size and fragmentation are features, not bugs.
If Taylor Swift wants to set up her own Mastodon instance, she can. If she wants to cross-post between that and X, she can. I won’t be seeking out her content and it will be trivial for me to stay in my bubble without Taylor algorithmically popping up inside of it like she is on IG, FB, and X.
Choice is a good thing. Small communites are good. Decentralized is good because then big bullies can’t come in and take your community away. Small size and fragmentation are features, not bugs.
Would be nice if the Fediverse had more of that.
There are three or four different “Technology” communities. But there might as well just be one, it’s the same bubble in each of them.
Every last god damn word of this. Well said.
Hell yeah, new copypasta just dropped!
Really though, you speak some truth, but it seems like you make the case for breaking up monopolies. Of course the current political environment in the US wouldn’t allow that, but you’ve identified winner take all. I disagree about whether it’s inevitable or does it take continual coersive action to stomp out that competition?
It should have never been allowed for Facebook to take over WhatsApp and Instagram or Google taking over YouTube… It’s the opposite of what capitalism should be according to people who defend it: allowing such mega monopolies destroys the few benefits the free market has to offer. It stunts innovation and encourages enshittification and anti consumer vendor lock-in behaviour
The brutal truth of social networks: people don’t stay for protocols, decentralization, or good intentions. They stay because everyone else is there. Building better infrastructure is impressive. Building a habit people refuse to leave is harder.
Everyone I know who’s tried it tells me that big corporate brands and their slop / astroturfed content is why Bluesky is less enjoyable. Haven’t myself, as I’m perfectly content on Mastodon and Lemmy, so I understand that’s anecdotal.
I use Bluesky all the time, and I barely ever see corporate brand stuff.
My actual gripe about Bluesky is that somehow they haven’t dropped an iPad app after four years. Or at the very least fixed issues with their iPhone app while using an iPad.
Many apps seem to have that problem on the iPad. It wasn’t until last year that Instagram was properly sized for it, as an example.
bsky is just another VC-funded corpo platform. The initial wave of Libs who moved over gave it some gas, but ultimately, it’s just another toxic, bland platform like all the others.
Mastodon is the same, its a cesspit. Its the microblogging format that attracts the worst people and fosters the worst interactions.
I agree. I initially moved over and just never really enjoyed opening the app for more than a couple minutes tops… I only keep it cuz some of the artists that I followed on Twitter moved over to Bluesky so I’m able to continue enjoying their content without the Nazis
It was kind of inevitable.
I don’t really use Bluesky I just bridged my Mastodon Account to bluesky and all I can say: There are more users bridging their Mastodon to Bluesky then Bluesky Users bridging to Mastodon.
Europe COULD push the Fediverse and show the Middlefinger to US Datahording Social Networks like Facebook, X/Twitter and Reddit but Some European Countries are not even close to the Digital Age.
And cocaine is better than caffeine
I was just wondering about bluesky. I joined a while back but never actually used it. Than some article came out that they also are planning to monetize bluesky and that was it for me. It just never got the traction or engagement as unfortunately Twitter (which I also never used)
There is a considerable number of users that stopped using Bluesky because of the Age Verification. I think that is playing a significant issue, along with corporate accounts being few and far between compared to Twitter. I really liked how it was set up vs my Mastodon and Twitter account I keep for contests and giveaways. It is a shame they had to go fascist like that.
Did those users not hear they can dodge Age Verification by using a different Bluesky compatible app?..
Bluesky are transphobic and Islamophobic “centrist” twats, but the protocol they’ve developed is kinda decentralized and so can be used against their wishes… there’s even one app where you can keep posting even if bsky.social or whatever your home instance is marked you as “banned”… lol.
Did those users not hear they can dodge Age Verification by using a different Bluesky compatible app?
And beyond that, it’s not like you can’t migrate to Blacksky or another third-party PDS, or even host your own PDS if you have the hardware and admin chops for it, although you can also self-host on the Fediverse too, and there’s thousands of instances on the Fediverse vs. a handful on ATproto, plus other than Blacksky who are supposedly completely independent from Bsky’s corporate infrastructure, most third-party PDSes and pretty much all self-hosted PDSes still have to interact with Bsky’s corporate infrastructure at some point where if you host a Fediverse instance, you own the whole thing.
Ha, I’ve always used a 3rd party app, I had no idea they started age verification.
Oh, I can post anywhere. I’m in my 50’s, and I know that alt clients can get around it, but that doesn’t change the fact that the service itself chose to “Papers Please” RLID its users when there wasn’t even political pressure to do it at the time in most of the places it operates. If it had changed to be trans and islamiaphobes then I am glad to be off there.
If it had changed to be trans and islamiaphobes
It hasn’t. Or the block lists I’m using are fucking amazing.
Isn’t Bluesky where all the left wing and Woke people moved to from Twitter when Elon Musk bought the thing?
I really don’t trust BlueSky. I feel like they call themselves federated as a marketing gimmick to convince people they’re better than every other corporate social network, but they’ve deliberately set it up so that 99.9% of everything is going through their central server anyway. And it frustrates me that a lot of people have bought into that lie. Fediverse has been here delivering on everything BlueSky promised to be and did so long before BlueSky even existed, and yet no one cares because BlueSky had the venture capital to push a bigger marketing campaign.
Unfortunately, people jumping ship from BlueSky still aren’t coming over here. So I don’t know what to make of this news really, I know it doesn’t mean what I wish it would mean.
No one should be using corporate social networks.
Unfortunately, most people wouldn’t even understand what that means. And many wouldn’t care. People don’t seem to care about things, even as those things chew them up.
Getting peers on board is probably the way to go.
The greed and narcissism of modern consumerist society has given everyone a dog-eat-dog worldview where working together as a species to solve problems, and making minor sacrifices, is “communism”. Moral and ethical bankruptcy is “freedom”.
Why plant a tree for future generations when you believe it won’t survive the climate in 50 years, or it will be felled to generate value for shareholders?
For a long time it felt like BlueSky was just a Blue MAGA version of X. It has gotten a bit better and I see more progressive discourse, but circa the 2024 election it was just a bunch of what I’m guessing were campaign-funded influencers/bots and then people that thrived off that bubble without realizing they were in an echo chamber. I think it is great that alternatives exists, especially since I got banned from X for criticizing Musk. It is at least reassuring when I see various companies/politicians not merely relying on Twitter/X these days.
