Simple. Star Wars has 6 episodes, and that’s it. The rest is odd fan fiction that happens to be filmed in Hollywood. Now, enjoy!
It’s sad. For almost ten years people have argued about what went wrong with Star Wars.
Too many genres? The EU was scattershot and unfocused at times, but never hurt the brand in a significant way. In fact, it led to some great books and games
Too much politics? The villain of TPM is named after Newt Gingrich, and nobody really cared. ANH was inspired by Vietnam, and was still a box office hit.
The fanbase hates (insert minority)? While the internet has magnified the extreme weirdos, all six films have some mix of assertive female leads and non-white characters. Lando blew up the Death Star, Mace Windu was considered second only to Yoda. Every clone, etc. Still had a successful brand. Clone Wars focused hard on the clones and is put above the prequels by many of the hardcore fans. This isn’t to say there aren’t awful people who acted unhinged, but that goes for basically every large group of people in human history, let alone fandoms on the internet.
The answer is quality of writing. The originals were written well, and had coherent world building. The prequels struggled with character writing and general complexity, which is why they are more divisive. Good writing is the difference between the comedy of C-3PO and Jar Jar. It’s the difference between Luke and Rey. And it’s the difference between soul and slop.
The people at Disney either don’t understand this, or don’t care. It is an organization of Nico Harrisons who don’t understand the fundamentals of their industry. This pattern has been repeating across pop culture since the 2010’s, and was blamed on culture war instead of the real issue. It’s a miracle that something like Rogue One or Andor was ever greenlit.
Also, did you know the box office drop-off between 4 and 5 is the same, down to the percentage point, as the drop-off between 7 and 8? And yet, 5 is the most beloved, while 8 had so much backlash that Disney panicked and turned 9 into damage control, instead of working off of 8.
The difference? ESB is well written. TLJ broke space combat entirely for a cool visual. I don’t want to absolve TFA, which gets off way too easy because of what followed, but this comment is already too long…
Let me blow this wide open. I don’t think anything went wrong with it, there was just too much Star Wars and I stopped caring. The same with Marvel stuff , I watched it all and then bam I couldn’t be bothered to watch Endgame and I haven’t watched any since. And I’ve always been more of a Trekkie. I watched every single episode of every season of every Star Trek but I just can’t be arsed to watch the last seasons of New Worlds, it is fine but I have had my fill. Or maybe I got old and it just doesn’t do it for me any more?
Lightsabers are overrated.
I’m a huge star wars fan, every time I hear star wars fans complaining about Star Wars it’s literally just this:
The last Star Wars movie I enjoyed was Jedi: Survivor.
Ironically, the last Indiana Jones movie I enjoyed was Indiana Jones and the Great Circle.
so you prefer cinematic games to movies? no criticism, that’s just what it looks like. me too.
I don’t think anyone hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans.
I have watched every single Star Wars movie in theatres since I was a kid and they released the special editions in theatres. But last Jedi was so bad that I didn’t even bother to go see rise of skywalker. Not just in theatres, i still haven’t watched it to this day.
Same here
how will you learn how palpatine came back for reasons now?
You’re not missing out, in my opinion it was not a good movie in any sense.
I thought the first movie of the new trilogy was actually pretty good though.
There are valid criticisms of it but it was all around a solid start to the next chapter of the franchise.
Then the last Jedi happened. Fuck that. And then whatever the rise of skywalker is. Oh emperor palpatine is alive again for no reason at all, woo.
If they’d have just kept the expanded universe canon and moved forward with that then everything would have been fine. But no. Let’s have an aggressive needlessly secretive admiral lady ram a starship, because “believe women” somehow also means “women are incapable of lying” or whatever the fuck the point of that idiocy was.
It’s just so fucking bad.
I used to do a little camera work. #7 has my favorite shot/camera angle of the entire franchise. they told a lot of that story visually.
People disagree on this often. I thought 7-8-9 was shit. However 8 was a special kind of shit. I think half of the movie was really good. The other half of it, was absolute dogshit. At least it wasn’t a “'memba” fest like 7 and 9. It tried to do original stuff, but it fucked up royally on the pursuit / canto arcs. And I’m not even talking about the hyperspace ramming.
However the Luke + Rey + Kylo arcs were genius. People hate it for the old man drinking aliencowtitjuice and being a bitter old man and for his sacrifice, but it’s actually very characteristic of him. And the mystery of Rey’s past and her connection with Kylo is very well done and explores things never seen before.
I wonder what the story behind this is. And whether Johnson had to make concessions for Disney.
This whole thread is just ignoring Clone Wars, Rebels & Bad Batch. (And the “Tales of” series.)
I view television as an inferior form of media to film when it comes to a series like this.
If you can make it good in the length of a movie, that’s more impressive than doing it over multiple episodes and it doesn’t take 20 hours to get there.
I have ADHD.
different media have different goals and require different writing skillsets. sometimes the story is better in long format compared to being abbreviated.
honestly, Disney’s treatment of the franchise killed my life long love for it
Lucas had already taken it out to the woodshed several times.
The franchise has historically been at its best in the fallow years, when people were just tapping into the IP to tell their own stories.
But you can say the same of Trek, of Harry Potter, of Marvel and DCU. Any time the suits take over, content trends towards slop
Agreed… however, I do have a specially dark and bitter place in my heart for Disney. They have a rotten touch and ruin every IP they buy
I mean, I generally like their original work. Moana, Lilo and Stitch, The Incredibles, Zootopia - all very entertaining, creative, and packed with talented performances.
And they can even make solid kids action movies. Disenchanted, Hocus Pocus, the original Pirates of the Caribbean, Tron - it’s clearly within the capacity of the studio to make good films.
When they buy up these outside franchises and “Disney-fy” them, though… Woof.
disenchanted was disney? i thought that was primarily a groening project.
LucasArts did some of the best Star Wars games. I loved Jedi Outcast, best jedi experience out there, and X-Wing Alliance thanks to the amount of ships the game gave you
I absolutely love the Republic/Imperial Commando series by Karen Traviss which ended in a massive cliffhanger because Disney took over and didn’t allow her to continue.
Fuck Disney, all my homies hate Disney!
There are dozens of us!
Yeah, its all mostly meh. The originals were great mostly because I was a kid. Prequels were trash, but 3 was the worst of them. 7 was only better because it looked like they were going back to the roots of SW. 8 and 9 were absolute trash. S1 of Andor and Mando were some of the best stuff they’ve done in that universe. The rest of it adds very little value at all.
That said, the universe itself is rich and interesting and I wish there was more content that dives into it. KOTOR was my favorite entry in the universe overall and arguably has the best writing.
Also, I would still love to see a buddy cop sitcom set in some metropolitan planet. Think Brooklyn 99 in space. Doesn’t even have to be SW. I just want this show.
Prequels were trash, but 3 was the worst of them.
TWO was the worst of them, IMHO, but you deserve credit for realizing that 3 is overrated and a saber battle with lava and a bunch of good guys dying just makes it dark, not good. It has every issue that 1 and 2 do, and adds a few new ones.
Dial back Jar Jar, age Anakin up 5 years, and accept that Liam Neeson is the lead, and you’ve got a halfway decent Star War.
Q: Why did Qui-Gon lose to Maul? A: He was tired from carrying the whole movie.Two is only “better” due to the fact it was entirely unmemorable. I recall something about a cloning facility on a water world and some robot guy that wasn’t a robot.
The worst sin in three IMHO was belaboring every little plot point to connect up to four. It was brutal to watch. In many ways it reminded me of the “writing” for the last season of GoT.
Yeah, I just stopped paying attention altogether. The sequel trilogy is worse than the Holiday Special lol. I saw Rogue One and I was bored to tears. The Outlaws game requires an EA account to play. Star Wars is dead to me.
I saw Rogue One and I was bored to tears
Alright, hold up
I like Rogue One, but for the life of me I can’t figure out why people love Rogue One. It’s a decent enough Dirty Dozen riff in a Star Wars Skin Suit, but it has terrible pacing, a story that didn’t particularly need to be told, unengaging leads (rewatch after Andor helps some but not entirely), and too much fan service. It’s nice that it allows some whisps of moral ambiguity into the Rebellion, and it’s absolutely saved by the climactic battle, but I do not get the universal and enthusiastic acclaim.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. Episode 8 is better.
Yeah out of all the meh Star wars and they go to rogue one? To me there’s only the originals, andor, and rogue one
The mandalorian is solid too.
Up until he gives the dark saber away for no fucking reason at all. That was stupid.
Lol rogue one is the best star wars movie of this century. Not saying its a good movie, just the best star wars movie
It’s also a good movie
Isn’t Outlaws Ubisoft?
Yes, but regardless, the real LucasArts Outlaws is on GoG.
OH MARRRRSHALLLLLLLL!!!
Red Letter Media’s final thoughts on the state of Star Wars were pretty insightful: It’s become a container with a very specific aesthetic that Disney can pile an infinite number of things into: multi-quadrant science fiction blockbusters, preschool cartoons, carnival rides, political dramas, kids adventures, whatever.
It’s since stopped being a finite thing anyone can love anymore. When something becomes everything, it loses distinctness. That distinctness, whatever it was, is what early fans originally fell in love with.
Of course, those original objects still exist, but you have to specify them. You’re an “original trilogy” fan or an Andor fan or the made-for-TV Ewok movies fan†, but saying you’re a Star Wars fan is basically meaningless now. And for people who proudly wore that mantle, through eyerolls and ridicule, that’s a genuine loss.
† Teek from Battle for Endor has a posse.
“Want to sell a lot? Just brand it Star Wars!”
The motivation for making a new show should be “We want to tell an amazing new story set within the Star Wars universe” but it’s actually “We want to make loads of money, therefore our new thing is going to be Star Wars.”
but saying you’re a Star Wars fan is basically meaningless now. And for people who proudly wore that mantle, through eyerolls and ridicule, that’s a genuine loss.
I remember explaining something similar to my partner (not about Star Wars) and about how this isn’t about “gatekeeping” (though it can become gatekeeping) but rather about this loss. I can’t remember exactly what it was about now, but it was some aspect of nerd culture that didn’t exactly become mainstream, but rather morphed to become mainstream.
Disney Star Wars: MCU.
They’re giving Jaxon a movie?
Who?
I’ve actually come to dread when they add a sequel to a good movie.
For every Terminator two there’s a Phantom menace.
For every Terminator 2 there are thousands of Phantom Menaces. It was one of very few good sequels to ever exist.
I enjoyed the P.M., cool world building and lore going on. The new shit however has nothing new or cool.
For all their flaws at least the pt expanded the universe in a coherent and believable way.
