• yoriaiko@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    15 hours ago

    Let noob ask a question please, but ain’t Warhammer lore a parody for war and nationalistic shit, even thru “purge xenos” yells?

    I’ve actually never played actual tabletop, but some video games… I know memes only.

    • BeardededSquidward@lemmy.blahaj.zone
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      14 hours ago

      Rogue Trader which it was based on was a parody yes had a lot of references to politicians or political doctrine at the time. It evolved over the editions as it gained popularity, especially outside the UK. The parody now is much darker in tone, less comedic or silly. The problem is they started to realize how cool the setting was as they developed it and took out even more of that satirical bite. There’s some satire still but it’s not as on the nose now.

    • Riverview_Legal@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      14 hours ago

      In the early years Warhammer 40k was satire on conservatives, Marget Thatcher,

      We can add to that Priestley’s lived experience in mid 20th century Britain; the long-tail of the Second World War and the end of British Empire; the ongoing civil discontent of the '70s and '80s between trade unions and the government; the UK’s ongoing military operations in Northern Ireland; state sanctioned support for the South African Apartheid government; and the Falklands war. All fed into an early 40k corpus that was politically charged and anti-authoritarian.

      Even so, the game’s general message was typical of most punk pop culture of the period: authorities are oppressive, corrupt, and bureaucratic; advanced warfare is still barbaric; systems of oppression inevitably create the rebellions that they use to justify themselves; and so on.

      https://www.wargamer.com/warhammer-40k/satire

      From the very beginning, Warhammer 40,000 wasn’t a straight military setting. It was a joke; a loud, gaudy, aggressively unsubtle joke told by people who were deeply suspicious of power and perfectly willing to mock it. The early writers weren’t trying to smuggle politics into a neutral universe; they were holding up a funhouse mirror to the authoritarian impulses of the late twentieth century and exaggerating them until they became grotesque. The Imperium wasn’t designed to be admired. It was designed to be too much; too cruel, too bureaucratic, too pious, too militarised. A warning dressed up as a wargame.

      The satire was everywhere. The Imperium’s bureaucracy was so swollen it became a character in its own right, a kind of cosmic Civil Service (perhaps a DMV for our American cousins?) with skulls glued to it. The Inquisition was a parody of purity culture, a machine that valued suspicion over truth and zeal over competence. Space Marines were propaganda posters made flesh, the state’s ideal soldier stripped of humanity and sold back to the public as salvation. Even the tagline: “In the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war”. This wasn’t a mission statement. It was a punchline. A bleak little wink that said: this is what happens when a society builds itself entirely around fear and obedience.

      https://norerolls.co.uk/2026/02/03/the-strange-half-life-of-politics-and-satire-in-warhammer-40000/

  • FiniteBanjo@feddit.online
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 day ago

    Supposedly, the God Emperor was always around and just hands off of human affairs until they Apocalypsed earth, then he took charge to save the species.

    It’s possible that he probably came about before and then caused the Apocalypse, like some sort of psyker mutant test tube baby Oligarch.

    History written by the victors and all that.

  • Riverview_Legal@lemmy.ca
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 day ago

    Yes, Inquisitor. This one right here is sprouting heresy. Something about the Imperium of Man will be the downfall of mankind.

  • AllNewTypeFace@leminal.space
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 day ago

    I imagine that, if you’re a 10-year-old boy, fascism can look pretty awesome. Lots of action, badass uniforms and weapons, skulls and stuff, and no icky girls bringing their cooties into your top-sekrit treehouse.

  • bigmamoth@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    1 day ago

    The worst exemple you could choose is wharamer 40k. Like the fucking universe where humanity has to fight to survive. And fight more horrible things than even exist in ours.

    • Passerby6497@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      24 hours ago

      Edit for all the moron than think politics are an integral part of wharamer juste replace wharamer with full metal jacket and how it was meant to show war ks horrible and the audience got the message thebmilitarybis cool.

      I always love the irony of someone being called stupid in a borderline illiterate response.

      Especially when you’re completely uninformed about the history of “wharamer”

    • drcobaltjedi@programming.dev
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 day ago

      Bruh, 40K literally started as a satire of fascism during the punk movement. From medium:

      The farther we go forward in time, the more Umberto Eco’s seminal essay on the definition of fascism (“Ur-Fascism”, 1995) applies. Read these (very abridged) qualifiers and think about what you know about 40k, space marines, and the Imperium of Man.

      1. Cult of Tradition/Traditionalism
      2. Rejection of Modernism
      3. Cult of Action for Action’s Sake
      4. Disagreement is treason.
      5. Racist by definition/diversity is bad.
      6. Derives power from individual or social frustration.
      7. Nationalism/Tribalism/”Appeals to people who feel deprived of a clear social identity”
      8. Followers feel humiliated.
      9. Life is lived for struggle/life is permanent…

      Think about every line you know from 40k, and everything that ever happens in this setting. It’s incredibly fascist coded and the fault of the fascists for being in their situation.

      • FiniteBanjo@feddit.online
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 day ago

        TBF the videogames have been a little lighter on the irony than the original works. And the user does make a point that there are surprisingly worse fates than service of the empire in 40K, namely the (other) chaos gods.

    • [deleted]@piefed.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 day ago

      40k is a story of humanity colonizing the stars, committing genocide, and then acting like a victim because aliens fought back and their oppressive genetic overlords turned on each other.

      The obvious satire clearly went over your head.

      • ddplf@szmer.info
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 day ago

        no no look here. bitch. point is. WAR. IS. FREAKIN! COOOL!!!.

        and i also like gunz

      • bigmamoth@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 day ago

        “aliens fought back” bro do u hear yourself ? u think we gonna sit with them and have peace talk ? the point of the setting is a never ending war and humanity is at war with force that dont negotiate

    • Egonallanon@feddit.uk
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      1 day ago

      Nah the entire point of the 40k is a satire of fascism and all the horrors it brings. Humanity is fighting to survive because everyone else in the universe quite rightly hates them for their 10,000 year campaign of conquest and genocide. Even the more horrible things than humanity like chaos are heavily bolstered and fed by the actions of the imperium. Every problem humanity faces in the 40k universe(except the orks I guess) is of their own doing.

      • Salamanderwizard@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 day ago

        I’m not with buddy. More here to talk about the lore of W.H.

        Didn’t humanity try to be peaceful at first, but then the other species used our kindness as a way to take advantage of us?

        Again, I’m not getting into the political side of it, just the lore.

        • Egonallanon@feddit.uk
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          1 day ago

          Lore wise humanity was more chill in the dark age of technology and earlier there was a lot a lot of back and forth though a lot that lore is deliberately very vague and there certainly might be parts of it I don’t know as it’s been a couple of years since my last 40k lore hyperfixation. For the 10,000 years or so the setting primarily covers humanity is full on murder mode from the moment the emperor elects to reveal himself to humanity, conquer terra and engage in the campaign of galactic conquest.

          • Salamanderwizard@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            1 day ago

            Ah I gotcha. I don’t get a lot of time to read nowadays, but what I have gotten from YouTube channels lately has been cool to learn about.

            Humans are definitely not the good guys. But I don’t think anyone really is in that world. Tau maybe and Orks are just Orks. Can’t fault a bird for flying and fish for swimming, won’t hate a Ork for Waaaggghing.

            The dark age is def a section I wanna know more about. It’s when A.I turned against right?

            • Egonallanon@feddit.uk
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              0
              ·
              1 day ago

              Tau very much aren’t good guys with their rigid caste system and the “join us ‘peacefully’ and definetly of your own volition or by force” expansionism. Orks are an unrelenting pack of bastard mushrooms to everyone all the time.

              Yeah the war against the men of iron and the eventual outlawing of AI oingst humanity as a result is part of the DAOT and it’s downfall.

              • Salamanderwizard@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                1 day ago

                Yea, when you put it that way. Was thinking more of the they’re the youngest. But then I think about the krok(?) Who they send in to eat the enemy. As well as if I remember they use brainwashing, don’t they.

                Honestly, it sounds like at the end of the day, if you are born human in that world, just pray you can live to see tomorrow.

                Edit: you could also say the Orks are a bad shroom trip. ba dum tsh

          • CrimeIsLegalNow@ani.social
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            1 day ago

            Less “better” more not waging a literal genocide crusade from the comments made by surviving AIs from the Cybernetic Revolt. Only in that context it was only because AIs don’t have genes.

            It’s also hard to tell because it was before the Eldar got got by Slaanesh so there’s a big element of humans simply not having the power to do it even with their higher tech level.

            • Salamanderwizard@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              0
              ·
              1 day ago

              Ooh ok. So just to be clear. Slaneesh wasn’t even born yet when the Imperium was trying to conquer the stars? I know they’re the newest of Chaos gods. Just didn’t know if they were before Big E’s galaxy conquest plan or after.

              • TrippaSnippa@aussie.zone
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                1 day ago

                Slaanesh was born after the Emperor conquered and unified Terra in M31. This cleared up the warp storms that had isolated most human worlds from each other during the Age of Strife and allowed the newly formed Imperium to begin to conquer the galaxy.

      • bigmamoth@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 day ago

        yeah except the ork, the insect that just wanna propage indefinetly like a cancer and the warp ppl that are just under control of an entity that want the end of mankind. who the fuck in that universe is like your war was really mean we gonna make a never ending war in revenge ?

        how the fuck u saw 40k and think fsatire of facism ???

        • A_Union_of_Kobolds@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          1 day ago

          how the fuck u saw 40k and think fsatire of facism ???

          Because thats how it started? The Imperium is not a good place to live. It is the cruelest and most bloody regime imaginable, per every 40k book ever. It is a setting with zero “good” factions.

          • bigmamoth@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            1 day ago

            Yeah so can u imagine any other type of regime for this hellscape universe ? Do u think the settings was build to criticize political regime ??? How the fuck can you write it s a satire of facism ??? It s not and isn’t even the point of the IP and all the derivative that came from it Wtf

            • Telodzrum@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              0
              ·
              1 day ago

              T’au and Leagues of Votann are both doing well and not horrible places to live. The Craftworlds are nice enough.

              James Workshop has been pretty fucking direct and consistent that the IoM is horrible and it’s largely humanity in general and Big E specifically to blame.

              • HerbGrower@slrpnk.net
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                13 hours ago

                I thought it was more the fanatical religious cult that formed around the emperor rather than him as a person that turned the imperium to shit

                • Telodzrum@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  13 hours ago

                  He was a fedoraclad, Reddit-atheist, autocrat with delusions of grandeur, a messiah complex, and a love of violence without regard for the agency or even the sapience and will of other people long before he was installed on the chair and became a god.

                  “The Last Church” is a story from during the Unification Wars on Earth, which long predate the Crusade and Hersey (and therefore are more than 11,000 years before the setting of 40k), which provides some insight into what a douchecanoe Big E has always been.

            • Egonallanon@feddit.uk
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              0
              ·
              1 day ago

              Yes that is exactly what it was done to do. Political satire was a central component to GWs early development of it’s properties(shouts out to the margaret thatcher banner) and it has remained part of it in varying degrees over the decades. You’re not supposed to like the imperium or any faction within 40k, it’s not a setting to be celebrated. It’s meant to be showing things at their absolute worst including the hyper racist empire that represents humanity.

              • bigmamoth@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                1 day ago

                Omfg. The hyper racist empire Lmao Yeah yeah everything is political and once again your identifying yourself with the bugs

                • A_Union_of_Kobolds@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  1 day ago

                  How could you possibly talk about fascism, a political system, without being political

                  My god man. We’re not making this shit up, this is literally the story behind 40k, per the people who wrote it.

                • Egonallanon@feddit.uk
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  1 day ago

                  Bro the imperium has a religious inquisition that goes around executing people for religious heresy and thought crime. Space marines are brainwashed, drugged up child soldiers and the mechanicus are so religiously conservative they’re essentialy the amish with laser rifles.