• brucethemoose@lemmy.world
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    17 hours ago

    This is bad.

    …But I’m very worried about the future of Wikipedia.

    Questionable leadership or not, it is a lighthouse in the information dystopia of the 2020s, which literally helps hold society together.

    The far right wants it gone, and are not shy about screaming it, because Wikipedia is not compatible with fascism.

    If it becomes hated by the left too, and ignored by the masses because of Big Tech blacklists it, I worry it won’t have the political support to keep its prominence.


    And to be clear, I’m not worried about it dying. Wikipedia will stay where it is for decades.

    I’m worried about it ceasing to be popular.

    It doesn’t function as a uncontrolled source of information if no one sees it. Modern fascist censorship works by simply shifting attention.

    • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
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      1 hour ago

      Questionable leadership or not, it is a lighthouse in the information dystopia of the 2020s, which literally helps hold society together.

      It pioneered a novel mechanism for collaborating on a project with minimal trust between contributors. But it was also riddled with bias and vulnerable to exploitation and as prone to cultivating disinformation as a universal source of truth.

      Rather than fixating on the site as some last bastion of Web 1.0 nostalgia, we would do well to do better than Wikipedia.

      Organizations like the Internet archive project have, imho, done as much or more than Wikipedia because of their commitment to accumulating primary source material. Managing that catalog and incorporating it into an encyclopedia of knowledge is much more than just stuffing a hard drive full of editor arguments and dead links from the old site.

      • brucethemoose@lemmy.world
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        60 minutes ago

        Well, unfortunately, there is no project like that with Wikipedia’s critical mass. Most attempts with any attention are rather horrific. See: Grokipedia.

        If Wikipedia dies, nothing good will replace it.

        I know that’s a bit defeatist, but I really think its “the best we got.” Nothing better is coming with the state the internet is in now.


        And I just want to emphasize that maybe a small community could build something better. I know.

        But in terms of “keeping a healthy knowledge base for civilization,” that kind of project doesn’t matter if no-one sees it. Wikipedia is valuable because its a reasonably sane default reference for billions of people, that isn’t some megacorp or government.

        • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
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          22 seconds ago

          Well, unfortunately, there is no project like that with Wikipedia’s critical mass. Most attempts with any attention are rather horrific. See: Grokipedia.

          Idk if you even want the kind of attention Wikipedia achieved, given how it ultimately became the target of endless waves of scams and influencer operations.

          That said, the Wiki format has been prolific in a way even the core website has not been. The core data for Wikipedia has been harvested and replicated across a thousand different boutique iterations. A lot of what made things like Grokipedia and Conservapedia and the rest flop is that these projects tried to administer the sites even more tightly than the original. And it’s an enormous project, so that loads a phenomenal amount of work on a handful of people.

          If Wikipedia dies, nothing good will replace it.

          That’s an absurd presumption. Just straight off the bat, you have the old Encyclopedia Britannica. You’ve got dozens of alternative Wiki competitors with their own rarified communities of editors and contributors. You’ve got subject-specific Wikis for a thousand different fandoms, hobbies, and crafts. You’ve got physical libraries. You’ve got digital libraries. You’ve got LLM compositions of libraries.

          The biggest flaw most of these have is the same one any search engine after Google had. “Why would I go here if I can just go to Wikipedia instead?”

          But the idea that tens of millions of curious people and subject-experts are just going to endure a vacuum? Come on.

          Wikipedia is valuable because its a reasonably sane default reference for billions of people

          It’s a very English-language and Euro-History oriented source of truth for tens of millions of online nerds. If it gets subsumed or shut down or otherwise undermined by western-aligned governments, I might suggest that the problem will not be an absence of Wikipedia but the presence of a malignant surveillance-enabled censorship bureaucracy.

          What you will experience is not merely a lack of oxygen but a surplus of boot on your neck.

    • lightnsfw@reddthat.com
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      2 hours ago

      Then they need to drop the losers behind this anti-union BS. This isn’t a complicated problem. If they’re against working people they don’t deserve political support. Anyone who cares enough can rip the site and rehost it elsewhere anyway or preferably multiple elsewheres so we don’t run into this issue again.

    • iocase@lemmy.zip
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      15 hours ago

      The Wikimedia foundation vastly outpaces expenses. Despite doing their best to convince you if you don’t donate $10 right now Wikipedia will literally evaporate 🥺🙏

      They can afford to not pay like shit

      They’re also wasting massive amounts of money on things outside their core mission and scope.

      • brucethemoose@lemmy.world
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        4 hours ago

        I think you missed my point.

        I’m not worried about them running out of funding. I’m worried about their reputation in the public’s eye.

        • iocase@lemmy.zip
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          2 hours ago

          No I got that I was just pointing out there’s no reason to do this besides naked greed

      • kazerniel@lemmy.world
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        5 hours ago

        thanks for this info, cancelled my recurring donation 😮‍💨 I’ll give that money to a small local org instead

    • Tollana1234567@lemmy.today
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      16 hours ago

      some entries are already questionable asf. some of them are written like an opinon piece, or a hs essay.

      • Scrollone@feddit.it
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        16 hours ago

        Wikipedia is made by people, like me and you. If you see bias or wrong information, you can either fix it or flag it with an appropriate template.

        • iegod@lemmy.zip
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          8 hours ago

          Unlikely you can just ‘fix’ most points on articles. They have mad gatekeepers.

        • AnBee@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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          15 hours ago

          I really would like to, but German Wikipedia for example is something of an inner circle where you can’t do shit. They don’t allow newcomers do touch most of the articles.

          • Eheran@lemmy.world
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            10 hours ago

            Please link such an article. I have never ever received a link to one when asking this question and I always ask for one/them when I read such “accusations”.

          • Scrollone@feddit.it
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            12 hours ago

            If you’re a newcomer, start with simple edits. Fix small mistakes. Show the community you can be trusted.