I’m almost sure I won’t get a serious answer but how is a joke about a specific person racist? It’s not about stereotypes, just similarity to a cartoon figure. I live in Europe and my head of state looks like Mr Burns (he really does). Is that racism against white people? What is the difference?
You should be staying humble, because there is A LONG and storied history of hatred and violence against chinese people and anti-asian (which includes poles & russians) hate in general in germany. The fact that you don’t think using a yellow-skinned bear as a caricature for an chinese person isnt is evidence for societal normalization of anti-asianism and Orientalism.
The difference is calling an Asian person yellow has a long and very racist precedent. It would be akin to saying Obama looks like Curious George because A) he fucking doesn’t and neither does Xi look like Winnie and B) there are similarly obvious racial connotations between saying a black man looks like a monkey and that an Asian man looks like a literally yellow character.
I stand corrected. This really is a serious answer. I finally understand the point.
I still disagree.
When I think Winnie the Pooh I think round face much more than yellow. Yellow is a very common color in cartoons. You can’t deny that. If that was the only reason, there’s a whole pool to chose from.
Comparing black people with non human monkeys plays on the historical “scientific racism” that puts white people on the top and black people somewhere close to apes and Asians somewhere in between (depending on political affiliations). Nowhere in history has anyone put Asians close to bears. Even if the motivation is skin color (which I cannot disprove), the comparison to black people as monkeys falls flat.
When I think Winnie the Pooh I think round face much more than yellow.
It doesn’t matter what you think. It what it’s received as. Also check out the first instance of the meme which has 💯 racist connotations. The one with xi and Obama compared to Winnie and… ? To which racial slur does the other character sound similar to?
From what I found, Obama was compared to T*gger. Sure, I see the rhyme and I’m sure it doesn’t matter what I think but I think this is far fetched. Other leaders were compared to other figures in the franchise. If you try to find something, you will. source
Also, this seams to be huge within China. Chinese people mocking their leader and the state censors it. And when people mock their leader, I side with the people, not the leader.
Racist dog whistles tend to sound like they are far fetched. They also have plausible deniability built into them e.g. the OK sign, pepe the frog memes, etc
Fact is: whenever you see some “anti-authoritrian” post the Winnie meme only to “criticize the CCP [sic]” you get a fuck ton of sinophobic comments from western libs below it and the OP never distancing themselves from it and often times doing it themselves too
This at least makes sense. I never encountered it so I’m still not convinced. Can you link some?
Also, this gives me “critiquing Israel is antisemitism” vibes. Might be a false tho. I think it’s important to question all power and all states and I would never be offended when someone mocks my head of state (who does not only look like Burns but resembles him in other ways too)
Just go on Reddit or yt or anywhere you see the Winnie meme posted.
this gives me “critiquing Israel is antisemitism” vibes.
When youd “critique Israel” using an octopus or a cartoon character with a large nose, etc. it would be antisemitic tho
I think it’s important to question all power and all states and I would never be offended when someone mocks my head of state
Sure and I agree, but using a racist dog whistle is not mocking. Regardless of head of state. And in this specific instance it’s mostly western liberals doing so, being also running dogs for the western imperial project
my understanding is that China’s population is largely satisfied with their government, and I can understand that since I’ve seen nothing but endless improvements year over year for the last ten years now, despite constant “china’s about to collapse” and other actually insane propaganda about China so yeah pardon me for thinking you should back up your claim that “calling xi jinping winnie the poo is huge in china (even though the GOVERNMENT will KILL YOU FOR IT)”
The difference is the long racist history of refering to Asian people as yellow skinned, phrases like “yellow peril” describing fears of Asian immigrants, so it’s not a stretch to see how depicting a Chinese man with cartoonishly yellow skin is racist as fuck.
It would be like depicting a black politician as a monkey, it’s difficult to defend something like that as just a joke against a specific person when there’s such a racist connotation/history there.
I’m almost sure I won’t get a serious answer but how is a joke about a specific person racist? It’s not about stereotypes, just similarity to a cartoon figure. I live in Europe and my head of state looks like Mr Burns (he really does). Is that racism against white people? What is the difference?
You should be staying humble, because there is A LONG and storied history of hatred and violence against chinese people and anti-asian (which includes poles & russians) hate in general in germany. The fact that you don’t think using a yellow-skinned bear as a caricature for an chinese person isnt is evidence for societal normalization of anti-asianism and Orientalism.
The difference is calling an Asian person yellow has a long and very racist precedent. It would be akin to saying Obama looks like Curious George because A) he fucking doesn’t and neither does Xi look like Winnie and B) there are similarly obvious racial connotations between saying a black man looks like a monkey and that an Asian man looks like a literally yellow character.
When I think Winnie the Pooh I think round face much more than yellow. Yellow is a very common color in cartoons. You can’t deny that. If that was the only reason, there’s a whole pool to chose from.
Comparing black people with non human monkeys plays on the historical “scientific racism” that puts white people on the top and black people somewhere close to apes and Asians somewhere in between (depending on political affiliations). Nowhere in history has anyone put Asians close to bears. Even if the motivation is skin color (which I cannot disprove), the comparison to black people as monkeys falls flat.
https://lemmy.ml/comment/21791130
It doesn’t matter what you think. It what it’s received as. Also check out the first instance of the meme which has 💯 racist connotations. The one with xi and Obama compared to Winnie and… ? To which racial slur does the other character sound similar to?
From what I found, Obama was compared to T*gger. Sure, I see the rhyme and I’m sure it doesn’t matter what I think but I think this is far fetched. Other leaders were compared to other figures in the franchise. If you try to find something, you will. source
Also, this seams to be huge within China. Chinese people mocking their leader and the state censors it. And when people mock their leader, I side with the people, not the leader.
Racist dog whistles tend to sound like they are far fetched. They also have plausible deniability built into them e.g. the OK sign, pepe the frog memes, etc
Fact is: whenever you see some “anti-authoritrian” post the Winnie meme only to “criticize the CCP [sic]” you get a fuck ton of sinophobic comments from western libs below it and the OP never distancing themselves from it and often times doing it themselves too
This at least makes sense. I never encountered it so I’m still not convinced. Can you link some?
Also, this gives me “critiquing Israel is antisemitism” vibes. Might be a false tho. I think it’s important to question all power and all states and I would never be offended when someone mocks my head of state (who does not only look like Burns but resembles him in other ways too)
Just go on Reddit or yt or anywhere you see the Winnie meme posted.
When youd “critique Israel” using an octopus or a cartoon character with a large nose, etc. it would be antisemitic tho
Sure and I agree, but using a racist dog whistle is not mocking. Regardless of head of state. And in this specific instance it’s mostly western liberals doing so, being also running dogs for the western imperial project
You base this on…?
John Oliver said so, which means it’s true.
Oh yes, this is the kind of reaction I expected from the start. Thank others that they proved me wrong.
People pointing out that a claim has no basis or evidence is proving it wrong
my understanding is that China’s population is largely satisfied with their government, and I can understand that since I’ve seen nothing but endless improvements year over year for the last ten years now, despite constant “china’s about to collapse” and other actually insane propaganda about China so yeah pardon me for thinking you should back up your claim that “calling xi jinping winnie the poo is huge in china (even though the GOVERNMENT will KILL YOU FOR IT)”
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Yeah what the hell was that person thinking, asking you to show any evidence for the garbage that you spew without any regard for accuracy
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I’ll try to provide a serious answer.
The difference is the long racist history of refering to Asian people as yellow skinned, phrases like “yellow peril” describing fears of Asian immigrants, so it’s not a stretch to see how depicting a Chinese man with cartoonishly yellow skin is racist as fuck.
It would be like depicting a black politician as a monkey, it’s difficult to defend something like that as just a joke against a specific person when there’s such a racist connotation/history there.